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2/5 Twin river casino - Gambling with straight draw

Vilain 1 and 2 are both solid and pretty tight, especially Vilain 2 who is probably the best player at the table.

Effective stacks 550

Vilain 1 raises 25 from MP1
Hero calls from MP2 with QJo
Vilain 2 calls from button
BB calls.

Flop T94 :r:

BB checks, Vilain 1 bets 75, Hero calls, Vilain 2 raises to 275, BB folds, Vilain 1 shoves all in, Hero re-shoves, Vilain 2 calls.

Vilain 1 has T9
Vilain 2 has TT

I call the 75 of vilain 1, wanting to have more callers and get more money in the pot if I hit my straight (especially with rainbow board). Once it is my turn to act again, I know Vilain 2 will call but still decide to go for it. I now think it was too gambly. From Poker Stove I see I need to have 30% equity for it to be a proper shove. I have 28% equity in this hand.

Thoughts?

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Comments

  • AlduneAldune Posts: 55Subscriber, Professional
    Preflop police said it's a fold.
    On the flop reshoving can be good for image purposes, trying to put Villains on tilt, but only if your game will not be affected by the loss. Otherwise pretty easy fold after V1 ships.
  • nopairnopair Posts: 350Subscriber
    Fold preflop. 5x raise from a solid and pretty tight player and you jump in there with QJ and a medium stack. That's playing from behind for no good reason.

    As played, folding the flop is bad. $300 of dead money before V2's raise. Pot will be 300+450+450+450=1650. Your 28% share is 462. And if V2 folds to the shove, even better... especially if V1 has J8 or 98 on rare occasion.

    Bottom line, as played, your odds are marginally fine to go in with... but, I hope you aren't going to the casino to play marginally fine coinflip hands for all your chips. Next time, just fold this weak stuff against solid players.
  • alambic49alambic49 Posts: 87Subscriber
    nopair wrote: »
    Fold preflop. 5x raise from a solid and pretty tight player and you jump in there with QJ and a medium stack. That's playing from behind for no good reason.

    As played, folding the flop is bad. $300 of dead money before V2's raise. Pot will be 300+450+450+450=1650. Your 28% share is 462. And if V2 folds to the shove, even better... especially if V1 has J8 or 98 on rare occasion.

    Bottom line, as played, your odds are marginally fine to go in with... but, I hope you aren't going to the casino to play marginally fine coinflip hands for all your chips. Next time, just fold this weak stuff against solid players.

    About the preflop action, the standard raise at the table is 20. Isn't it fine calling a 25 raise from a player, in position, with QJ? Not the best of hands but I believe that a call in position can be profitable. You fold any QJ vs good players, in position?

  • nopairnopair Posts: 350Subscriber
    edited July 2017
    You ended up not in position. The button would be fine, but you say middle position 2.

    If you are going to choose to play, and specifically _call_, with a weaker hand with a negative expectation in general than what your opponent has, you should have good reason. One good reason is "this raiser is a donkey who spews often". I don't think "he is solid and tight" is a very good reason.

    If you do play it, you will have lots of situations like this, where when there is a lot of action you don't have a hand that is a big favorite. Having pot odds is not horrible, but it isn't great either. In other words, in this hand you want the TT not your QJ and certainly not the T9.

    At the least, wait until the cutoff for marginal hands against solid players -- though for almost everybody I'd say don't play weakish hands against good opponents. Focus your play on the weak opponents, and strong hands against solid opponents.
    Thanked by 2alambic49 hustlin
  • fishcakefishcake Posts: 1,002Subscriber
    Fold pre. Flop is spew. Whole hand is spew really. QJo is not a good hand against 5x opens from MP. You should look at some hand charts and fool around with equity calculators.
  • Rmikey17Rmikey17 Posts: 25Subscriber, Professional
    Preflop is questionable, as played I'd rather raise flop and try to push the better player out instead of calling a pot sized bet and having to play that OOP. Once you call you're giving the other play a good price as well as a ton of incentive to squeeze.
  • BKismBKism Posts: 203Subscriber, Professional
    I am not the preflop police, but QJo plays badly. JTo may even play better, since it is less likely to be dominated and may have more live straightening cards. You are in MP2, you can still be 3!, by any decent player who recognizes a good situation.

    The first domino of a poorly playing hand is tossing in 4 red chips with a very marginal hand. Now you are kind of stuck making the best of a bad situation on the flop.
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