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Needed: Bet Sizing Advice and River Play Advice for UTG Flopped Set with 5 Players in the Pot

GallmanGallman Posts: 70Subscriber
edited December 2014 in NLHE Strategy Discussion
As played please help me to understand how I should be approaching a situation which comes up maybe 5% of the time or less in a session. I realize that for some it is better to concentrate on fundamentals as that makes up the bulk of your hourly but I feel it is situations like these where it going to provide a lot of variance to your hourly. This is a $2/5 game with a $500 cap buyin 10 handed and most are sitting with the cap and above and only my third time in the $2/5 foray as I am trying to make the transition and am having a little bit of trouble swifty deciding on bet sizes due to being a $1/$2 player for years.

Hero limped UTG with 6 6 and UTG+1 makes it $15 to go and gets called by MP2, HJ, Button, and Hero.

FLOP Action: 6 J A
Hero checks with a plan to play it check/call any flop action, check raise the turn, and lead river should it make it that far. The preflop raiser checks as do the other two field players and the button bets out $40 into the pot of $75 (after rake). Hero smooth calls and the rest of the field folds.

Villain (button) info: Since this hand came up within the second hour of my session the only read I had on the Villain other than being a young 50 yr old euroamerican was that he was not going to spaz out, and rather he seem to play passively, cautious, and methodically. I had seen a few show downs he won in which he played AKsuited in position as a cold call to a single preflop raise as well as playing Ax-suited and pocketpairs with just a limp and then calling if a raise was made preflop.

Turn Action: 2 :s: making the board: 6 J A 2 :s: and Villain has Hero covered and we are playing with $1630 effective prior to any turn action. Hero checks as planned and Villain bets out $75 into the $155 pot, and Hero ck/raises to $225 making the pot $455 and making it $150 for Villain to call as he does with out much a second thought.

- As played on the turn should my check raise have been larger or smaller? I was going to make it $250, but it seems like that is somewhat large and I even think that $225 was on the large side as I am going for value if Villain has two pair like AJ (obv. the cannot have the J with AJ) or a hand like AK, AQ, even A10 of clubs, and A2-A5 of clubs, KQ of clubs, etc. Also, I think it is safe to rule out a set of Aces or Jacks as I think I would have heard from him.

River Action: Based on the action in the hand as played I need help on how I should be proceeding on the river based on any potential cards that may hit the Villains range like any club, Ace, Jack, or 10.
- If the river is a brick and I bet and get raised then I am playing for Stacks as I don't see him not reraising AA preflop although he might have just flatted with JJ preflop.
- If the river is one of those cards referenced above is this a ck/fold, bet/fold, or ???. Also if it is a bet fold what should be my bet sizing as I am sitting with $1405 and Villain has me covered by about $500.

Let me say thank you up front for any of you who decide to chime in on this post and provide your nuggets of knowledge and/or cynicism.
The river brought a 3 for a final board of 6 j A 2 :s 3 completing a flush and runner runner straight. I led for $250 as a bet/fold. Villain instantly shipped. I don't think that this particular Villain is going to be turning a set of Jacks or top two pair into a ship based on the passivity I saw in a few hand he played and how he is passive preflop without AA, KK, QQ. Unless he realizes that the turn action Caps my hand to top two pair, a set or a flush draw like 5 :c:3 with picks up a gutter on the turn. I think I pretty much at the end of the day I end up in the same river dilemma. Unless I just go spaz and ck/raise the flop something like $200 or the turn like $500


  • DrGambolDrGambol Posts: 724Subscriber
    "Hero checks with a plan to play it check/call any flop action, check raise the turn, and lead river should it make it that far."

    Why? It's an AJ6cc board. So many turn cards change the nuts. Any Broadway card completes a straight and any club puts a flush up. Calling the flop with your value hands is very risky. Also, many people aren't double barrelling their draws into multiway pots, so you will often be unable to get the c/r on the turn. And we also need to not only think about being outdrawn by a flush, but also the flush card killing our action from worse hands.

    Instead, I'd rather c/r the flop or lead myself. The more likely someone is to bet/call Ax, the more likely I am to c/r. If they are unlikely to cbet lightly, then I'd be more likely to lead.

    The main point here though is the board texture. A board like A72r can be slow played way more than AJ6ss or 876sss. And the more multiway it is, the less likely it should be slow played.
    Thanked by 1FreeLunch
  • luckyspewyluckyspewy Posts: 299Member
    I probably lead the flop with the plan of bet/3 betting.

    I would check raise a tight solid opponent on this flop and go for stacks by the river. He has AJ-AK so often and can take the heat.

    As played c/r larger on turn to set up a healthy pot sized bet on the river

    As played bet/fold the river. He's bluff raising so few times, mostly when he puts in the second bet he just has the nuts
    Thanked by 1floppedawheel
  • David ChanDavid Chan Posts: 1,208Pro
    if you are going to check this flop, then you should be going for a flop CR...not a flop check-call.

    Why? Well, the Ace on flop is offsuit to the flush draw. Therefore, there are a lot of TP+NFD hands that can definitely pay off a sizable flop CR and a big turn bet.

    Check-call on this flop is a pretty bad plan.
  • GallmanGallman Posts: 70Subscriber
    Anyone got a dollar amount based on the OP to ck/raise the flop "larger" rather than just telling Hero he should be ck/raising larger? I think this would be helpful since the title of the OP is bet sizing advice and I feel "larger or smaller" really isn't helpful based on all the details I provided in the OP.

    Thanks for helping out on this as I stated I am transitioning to the 2/5 game and feel I need maybe a little more depth in response then others on this site may need.
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