Welcome.

Take a tour. Enjoy some free sample content.

How it works

Free Video: CLP Video No. 287: Home Game Bart Reviews His Splashy At $1-$3 Deep Part 2

Free Podcast: CLP Podcast No. 54: Time Warp And Turn Value
New to Crush Live Poker?

1/3 3-bet pot turn decision

styxstyx Posts: 33Subscriber
1/3 NL uncapped

UTG limps, BTN (1k) raises 20, SB (700) laggy player calls 20, i (1k) 3-bet with AQo from the BB to 85.
UTG folds, BTN calls, SB calls.
Flop A 6 2
SB checks, i check, BTN checks.
Turn 7
SB checks, i bet 110 (3 clubs on the board now, i have no club), BTN folds, SB shoves for about 600 total.
Hero ?

Opinions on flop play are also welcome, my reasoning for checking was that i cant get three streets of value and i want at least some of the time to have a hand that can continue on the turn when i check the flop. If i only check with 99-KK, KQs and stuff like that my opponents can bet me off every time and SB is capable of doing it.

Whats the play here?

As an aside, even if it's not that relevant in live games, what do you think the GTO play is at this decision point? Do you think GTO strategy plays the hand the same way up to the decision point some percentage of the time?

Comments

  • stayinschoolstayinschool Posts: 2,969Subscriber
    Good 3 bet, a lot of people miss value by not squeezing this.

    I'd just bet flop big and jam turn, check isn't terrible, especially with Qc but i assume we don't have that given you didn't mention it.

    AP i call turn, I think people just have too many 1 club hands and i'm sure that some people shove worse Ax here afraid of like KK, QQ with a club.
  • pokeromcpokeromc Posts: 40Subscriber
    because of the flop check (and BTNs flop check), SB checking turn has zero reason to think you or BTN will bet this, so they probably aren't doing this with any hand ahead of yours. most will put you on hands like KK/QQ with a club and will be jamming their weaker Ax hands. you checked flop specifically for this reason.

  • Letmewin1Letmewin1 Posts: 1,244Member
    Great spot to squeeze pre. but I'd probably size a little larger, $100 seems good.
    I think betting flop is best, you don't have a strong enough hand that could allow a free card/equity realization, you don't really want some pair to catch up and not pay for it, so $130/$135 seems good.
    i think you need 34ish% when he jams, so if he's only jamming flushes then you don't have it but if he's jamming other parts as well because you checked flop multiway then I think calling is fine.
  • MonadPrimeMonadPrime Posts: 803Member
    Good 3 bet, a lot of people miss value by not squeezing this.

    I'd just bet flop big and jam turn, check isn't terrible, especially with Qc but i assume we don't have that given you didn't mention it.

    AP i call turn, I think people just have too many 1 club hands and i'm sure that some people shove worse Ax here afraid of like KK, QQ with a club.

    +1
  • styxstyx Posts: 33Subscriber
    edited July 2017
    Here is an example range for SB including all flushes, sets and aces up and a couple of semi-bluffs with one club.

    I dont think that he checks all those value hands twice, but even against this range i have 39% (and i need about 34%).

    http://propokertools.com/simulations/show?b=Ac+7c+6h+2c&g=he&h1=Ad+Qs&h2=Ax7x%2C+Ax6x%2C+Ax2x%2C+Axjc%2C+axtc%2C+kcqc%2C+kcjc%2C+qcjc%2C+jctc%2C+tc9c%2C+9c8c%2C+6c5c%2C+kxqc%2C+kcqx%2C+77%2C+66%2C+8x8c%2C+9x9c%2C+TxTc&s=generic


    Range i used is: Ax7x, Ax6x, Ax2x, Axjc, axtc, kcqc, kcjc, qcjc, jctc, tc9c, 9c8c, 6c5c, kxqc, kcqx, 77, 66, 8x8c, 9x9c, TxTc


    Result: Like pokeromc said, i checked the flop to get more action later in the hand, so i followed through and called. SB had A2 suited, run-it-twice, pot chopped.
  • neverlearn2neverlearn2 Posts: 2,862Subscriber
    whats happens when non Club falls on turn? do we get same type of action? Think betting flop is better line here. We have Ax in our range, AQ might be borderline to some people but hands <AJ are def. in their range they will call along with other draw hands. Not too many hands we beat will flat behind us on turn IMO.
  • styxstyx Posts: 33Subscriber
    whats happens when non Club falls on turn? do we get same type of action? Think betting flop is better line here. We have Ax in our range, AQ might be borderline to some people but hands <AJ are def. in their range they will call along with other draw hands. Not too many hands we beat will flat behind us on turn IMO.

    You think we get more action on the flop than on the turn after everybody checks the flop? I think we get more action on the turn for two reasons:
    1) Our range looks a little weaker (99-KK, some draws, air), so people could be more inclined to semi-bluff their draws, even weaker ones (usually in 3-bet pots it's hard to semi-bluff because the 3-bettor doesnt fold his stronge range often enough)
    2) There are more draws available on the turn. In this instance the club makes every one-club hand a flush draw, a heart would bring a bd-flush draw, the 7 brings some straight draws, a face card would bring some gutshot draws, etc)

    A weaker ace would probably call one street regardless, and usually fold vs a second barrel. I don't see why the hands that would call the flop wouldnt call the turn.

  • neverlearn2neverlearn2 Posts: 2,862Subscriber
    Not too many draws though in a 3! Pot if we give them somewhat std ranges.

    If we 3! Pre our range includes lots of pairs as well that will be berring flop as well being the preflop aggressor.

    If I called then j could see us checking flop but since we raised pre, we would bet KK in this spot a lot right? Would you go for the delay Cbet with KK?
Sign In or Register to comment.