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$2/$5: AK facing a flop checkraise 200BB deep

JoannaJoanna Posts: 428Member
edited April 2017 in NLHE Strategy Discussion
$1000 eff. V is a recreational LAG reg. Plays too many hands. Plays too many hands OOP. Plays too many hands in early positions. Flats too many 3bs OOP. All are interrelated of course. Seems to have a big ego. Likes to make moves and hero calls. Loves to talk strat at the table.

He's been opening a lot and I've been 3bing him a lot in position and of course he's frustrated. His response has been flatting my 3bs 100%.

6-handed, he opens UTG (MP2 6-handed) to $20, MP1 calls, I 3b to $80 in CO with A :s: K and only V calls.

K 6 :s: 3 :s: $187 He checks, I bet $125, he CRs to $325

For value I think he'd do this only with sets. For bluff I think he'd do this with 54s and a bunch of suited spade connectors such as 9 :s: 8 :s: and 7 :s: 5 :s: Maybe pair+FD like KQss or KJss. I have As so there should be less suited Aces in his range.So in other words I think it's either sets and a bunch of flush draws.

What should be our optimal line?
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Comments

  • MonadPrimeMonadPrime Posts: 803Member
    edited April 2017
    Based on villain description I'm overjoyed to just call down here. Many rec LAGs overplay weaker TP, many FDs, maybe turning some bottom pairs into bluffs, etc.
  • Letmewin1Letmewin1 Posts: 1,244Member
    Let's start with a call and see turn.
  • JonnyBlankJonnyBlank Posts: 14Subscriber
    Def. call; consider raise fold...but I lean twd call and evaluate turn. Your graphics show A but u say you held As?

    If that's the case, then he's weighted to top
    pairs and flush draws, and Ks makes a lot of sense...or bluffs which u want him to keep firing turns...

    I tend to give less credit for 66 or 33, and can't give him KK or AA. AKs is also really narrow but possible
  • squishmytomatosquishmytomato Posts: 352Subscriber, Professional
    do you have the A :s: ? sucks to have this card... but call.
  • JoannaJoanna Posts: 428Member
    i have A♠
    Thanked by 1pray4blank
  • JoannaJoanna Posts: 428Member
    if we call, do we call down spade turns?
  • Rysher8Rysher8 Posts: 234Subscriber
    Wow. So he opened under the gun, he's frustrated with you, and now he's X/R a King high flop. His range looks to me like K10-AK, 1010-QQ, and maybe something like QJss or a smaller pocket pair, though I put less weight on smaller pocket pairs and suited connectors as he's raising first to act.

    In sum, it feels like you are ahead almost always. I hate to get in full stacks here with a pair, but this might be one time it makes sense to raise and commit. You're going to get snapped off by the suited hands you're ahead of, and likely by any K. Of course you're stacking off against 66 or 33, but that may end up happening anyway if you call this and he bets a blank turn. Get it in now while he still likes his hand.
  • pray4blankpray4blank Posts: 141Subscriber
    edited April 2017
    If you call flop, I believe your hand looks very close to what it is. That is fine, but I think it means you probably shouldn't call a turn shove. My experiene with such villains is they assume you're calling with AK and AA here, so are much less likely to be bluffing their flush draws (especially when you're blocking the nut flush draw). So, as played, I'd call, and fold to most turn bets, but may shove on almost all non-spade turn checks.


    I think with A of spades, I'm very fine with checking this flop. Every turn is good for you (in a world where you didn't bet and he didn't check raise), and may encourage a lot of worse hands to give you two streets of value, still. I'm usually not trying to get stacks in here unless he's a pretty clueless type of lag, so I can get value on turn and river.

  • IdlecaillouIdlecaillou Posts: 121Subscriber
    Is there no value in raising here on flop ? We are really only losing to 2 hands here unless he flatted aces Oop pre flop which is almost impossible can he have 6 3 maybe Sounds like most of the opinions here are that he has some type of combo flush or straight draw. If that's our read then I'm not sure why we are flatting here and letting him set the price.
    I agree not a good idea to stack off a dime with one pair but if you have been pushing him around all day and he wants to run you down. This could be a great spot to 4 bet on flop imo
    If we get it all in and he has a draw. I think we only are behind 54 spades. But I'll to check if behind when we have a spade.
    I think he calls a shove with kxs and pair flush draw 54 spade maybe 54 off.
    I realize this is not the standard play but I just want to throw it out there and see what thoughts are

    Ps. My guess is Joanna moved in!
  • ClockClock Posts: 1,133Subscriber
    Vs given description we're obviously NEVER folding.
    Does he open small PP like 66 and 33 UTG? If you seen him open limp those at least once or twice - it's total fist pump shove. :tu: :lol:
    Even if not, I'm considering shoving here.

    The only consideration to flatting is if you think he's capable of making this move with complete total air, or say 88-TT and/or will continue to run a bluff - then just call all the way down.
    Sometimes he'll have it, but they way you described him - there's no way we can fold this here.
  • MonadPrimeMonadPrime Posts: 803Member
    Joanna wrote: »
    if we call, do we call down spade turns?

    I wouldn't. His range has too many FD in it imo. Also we could easily have flush here as well, so risky for them to rep that card.

  • JoannaJoanna Posts: 428Member
    But he will only hit the spade turn like 20% of the time. So if we just flat then we give him another chance to barrel turn while he might just fold if we jam flop. is it worth the risk though?
  • MonadPrimeMonadPrime Posts: 803Member
    edited April 2017
    Joanna wrote: »
    But he will only hit the spade turn like 20% of the time. So if we just flat then we give him another chance to barrel turn while he might just fold if we jam flop. is it worth the risk though?

    Some times it is, sometimes it isn't, depends on board texture & villain & position , but here it appears good to call down on most non spade run outs IMO.
  • maphacksmaphacks Posts: 2,009Subscriber
    edited April 2017
    I don't see how we can ever fold this against this type of villain. call flop and call (shove) any turn. this opponent will definitely have some pure air bluffs.

    no point in shoving flop
    Thanked by 1squishmytomato
  • MonadPrimeMonadPrime Posts: 803Member
    maphacks wrote: »
    I don't see how we can ever fold this against this type of villain. call flop and call (shove) any turn. this opponent will definitely have some pure air bluffs.

    no point in shoving flop

    You think there's a bunch of airballs in their range? Personally I'd want some showdown history to validate that despite villain description. But maybe you're right.
  • IdlecaillouIdlecaillou Posts: 121Subscriber
    So what happened ? No spoiler ?
  • JoannaJoanna Posts: 428Member
    maphacks wrote: »
    I don't see how we can ever fold this against this type of villain. call flop and call (shove) any turn. this opponent will definitely have some pure air bluffs.

    no point in shoving flop

    Wow. How did you know this? He had Q 9

  • JoannaJoanna Posts: 428Member
    edited April 2017
    Paging maphacks to explain his excellent thought process.. Isle 3
  • maphacksmaphacks Posts: 2,009Subscriber
    no special thought process. I made a good guess. next time he shows up with 66. just saying that I know those kind of players and I know they can bluff in very bad spots with very unreasonable holdings. he is sick of you so he wants to bluff NOW. he doesn't care about his hand because you can't have it all the time right?
    Thanked by 1Joanna
  • 2thdoctor2thdoctor Posts: 66Subscriber
    Joanna wrote: »
    maphacks wrote: »
    I don't see how we can ever fold this against this type of villain. call flop and call (shove) any turn. this opponent will definitely have some pure air bluffs.

    no point in shoving flop

    Wow. How did you know this? He had Q 9
    Joanna wrote: »
    maphacks wrote: »
    I don't see how we can ever fold this against this type of villain. call flop and call (shove) any turn. this opponent will definitely have some pure air bluffs.

    no point in shoving flop

    Wow. How did you know this? He had Q 9

    So did you call the c/r and call a shove on the turn?

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